Japan Should Acknowledge Its Past
If Japanese public figures such as Shintaro Ishihara, continue to deny that the Rape of Nanjing ever happened, the pain will remain―a useful tool for propagandists.
March 7, 2014 4:03 p.m. ET
"China's World: Keeping History's Horrors Alive" (World News, Feb. 26) makes a good point about China keeping the wounds of World War II open. I think that those wounds would close a lot cleaner and the scar would be less sore if the Japanese would acknowledge that the wounds exist.
As long as Japanese public figures such as Shintaro Ishihara, former governor of Tokyo, continue to deny that atrocities like the Rape of Nanjing ever happened, the pain will remain―a useful tool for propagandists.
John W. Caldwell
Dadeville Ala.
It is a lamentable mystery why the Japanese are excused from their sordid history of massacre. The answer may be that the Filipinos, Indonesians, Singaporeans, Burmese and countless others need to emulate the proper and effective techniques utilized by world Jewry in keeping the memory of death by massacre and genocide alive.
Myron Gananian
Menlo Park, Calif.
Japanese history textbooks barely mention Nanjing. Their actions say so much more than words. Given that, it doesn't seem out of left field that China and other Asian countries view Prime Minister Shinzo Abe's visit to the Yasukuni war shrine, in addition to his other comments, as some sort of threat.
Sonia Wong-Gerig
Oakdale, N.Y.
-----------------------------------------
@Justin Zhou
O.K. Let’s go forward.
I sincerely let you know another fact, footprint between the U.S. and Japan.
Peliryu island in Palau had one of the fiercest battles between the U.S. and Imperial Japan from Sep. 15 to Nov. 25, 1944.
On Sep. 15 1999, Japanese commemoration ceremony was held at Peliryu shrine in the island. The U.S. Marine veterans attended the Japanese ceremony.
Peliryu shrine has a monument with an inscription which U.S. Pacific Fleet admiral C.W. Nimitz was believed to compose, “Tourists from every country who visit this island should be told how courageous and patriotic were the Japanese soldiers who all died defending this island.”
On the same day, the U.S. commemoration ceremony was held at Bloody Nose Ridge in the island. At the U.S. ceremony, granddaughter of general Hideki Tojo offered a floral tribute, and son of admiral Tamon Yamaguchi raised his hand in salute to Bloody Nose Ridge Monument.
Bless you.
----------------------------------------------
@GARY FIELD
German compensation:
Most Japanese recognizes that Germany has compensated for Jewish genocide victims, but not yet for WW2 victim nation, people and companies. Therefore, whenever western, Chinese or Koran says “Japan should learn German way for compensation”, Japanese feel strange because Japan has fulfilled legal responsibilities and finished compensation completely and finally. In my understanding, in 1944 Germany captured 5.16 million Russian POWs, 470,000 were executed, 3 millions in POW camp were died from hunger. In 1996 negotiation between Germany and Poland began, $400 per each were tentatively paid for one million living forced workers. In 1953 Germany had concluded treaty for $20 billion compensation with the United Ally, but has not paid yet.
As you mentioned “German children learn Holocaust”. How about WW2?
Therefore, you may not know if Germany has compensated for ww2 victim nation, people and companies. Therefore, you should not say “Japan should learn German way” any more, right?
NANKING DEATH TOLL
All the primary sources support Japanese appeal number of around 40,000, however, never prove Chinese appeal number of 300,000.
That means, Japan has never denied the fact but accepted it while China has denied the fact and insisted revision. As a result, second source and thereafter source have been needed.
Above recognition must be bottom line for further exploring the issue beyond prejudges.
As you protest against Dr. Smythe’s research, you can show credible source of 200,000 as “revision”. We can discuss “revision” not only about death toll but also about ethnic unique way of slaughter.
Primary source
It is essential for due process not only academic and legal area but also real world including cyberspace. Even in Japanese domestic BBS, everybody requires source and identifies if it is primary, secondary or thereafter in order to avoid perjury and false charge.
Knights of Bushido
It can be reference but not primary source for discussion.
If you say some opinions with reasoning only by the book, your opinion may be objectively not enough strong. You can use the book as reference for logical thinking and background information.
Well, O.K. anyways, I will read the book in the future, maybe after several months…..or….within a year….maybe….
I provide you real primary source, the U.S. national archives.
100,000 Pages Declassified in Search for Japanese War Crimes Records
http://www.archives.gov/press/press-releases/2007/nr07-47.html
------------------------------------------------------------------------
@GARY FIELD
You mentioned lots of topics. Let's step by step. I like to converge topics into Nanjing incident to explore more.
(1)Tomio Hora is a famous pro-China person. His position is "First South attacked, second North counterattacked in Korean war " . Also, I have pointed out "Three ALLs policy was Chinese policy rather than Japanese". We can discuss later.
(2)If German compensated, National archives exist. Could you show me VERY primary source? The wiki mentioned quite different from Japanese recognition. This is absolutely information gap between Japan and Nations resulting communication gap such as between you and I.
(3)Primary source is essential for due process and All the primary source mentioned much below the number in Nanjing.
(4)[Next question to explore how Japan killed citizens in Nanjing]
Why did many Chinese citizens come back to Nanjing even after Imperial Japan, alleged "Massacres","Slaughters" and “Riben Guizi Monsters”, occupied the city?
Primary sources show coherent and non-contradict.
Dec 13 1937 200,000-250,000 (Dr. Smythe)(James Espy of the American vice-consul)
Jan 1938 250,000 (THE NORTH-CHINA DAILY NEWS)
Feb 1938 250,000 (Telegraph toward the Washington Secretary of State in the U.S.)
Feb 1938 250,000 (Dr. Bates)
Mar 1938 250,000 (Dr. Smythe)
Apr 1938 250,000-270,000 (Dr. Smythe)
(FYI)
Cited:
"WAR DAMAGE IN THE NANKING AREA" December, 1937 to March, 1938
URBAN AND RURAL SURVEYS By Dr. Lewis S. C. Smythe
http://www.history.gr.jp/~nanking/LSCSmythe.pdf
CITY SURVEY, POPULATION
The city of Nanking had before the war a population of just 1,000,000, which was considerably reduced by repeated bombings and latterly by approaching attack and the removal of all Chinese governmental organs. At the time the city fell (December 12-13), its population was between 200,000 and 250,000.
The persons reported in our sampling survey in March, multiplied by 50, give 221,150 as the population directly represented by the City Survey. This number was probably 80 to 90 per cent of the total residents at that time, some of whom lived in places not accessible to investigators.
There was no great change in February and March, but a noticeable inflow from less orderly areas near the city probably built up a small surplus over departures, which also were visible significant.
-------------------------------------------------
@Susan Lim
Let's focus on the fact, not denying but accepting, O.K?
We will find who is denying the fact. You said "Japanese deny history". Are you sure? Japan has accepted the fact, not denying.
Though you mentioned lots of topics, we are discussing Nanjing incident now.
So by step by step, shall we start discussion about Nanjing incident first?
I show you primary source below. Do you deny the fact or accept it?
"WAR DAMAGE IN THE NANKING AREA" December, 1937 to March, 1938
URBAN AND RURAL SURVEYS By Dr. Lewis S. C. Smythe
http://www.history.gr.jp/~nanking/LSCSmythe.pdf
In return, could you show me "the fact" you think?
All you need is to show Japan CLEAR evidences such as primary sources as soon as possible unless no evidence from the beginning.
Otherwise, you fail interpretation or perjury.
(FYI)
Primary sources are original materials that have not been altered or distorted in any way. Example of non-primary source is such as wiki and information from the person who knows the sister of the friend of her aunt of the witness.
I am here.
-------------------------------------------
@GARY FIELD
The U.S. and Japan drills together today as usual.
Ignoring the today's fact and footsteps between the U.S. and Japan,
Jusutin simply tried to promote hate emotion by the movie of the past war.
---------------------------------------------
Just a TPO stuff.
When purely academic study and discussion purpose, such would be acceptable for everybody.
Let's keep holding honorable mutual respect mentality and sincere attitude especially when we discuss touchy issues.
I know this topic requires us mental toughness.
Let's go forward.
--------------------------------------------
@ Justin Zhou
Let’s shí shì qiú shì (Based on the facts, searching for the truth of the case) (objective positivism).
We should not discuss fantasy any more.
Again and again,
all you need is to show Japan CLEAR evidences such as primary sources as soon as possible unless no evidence from the beginning.
-------------------------------------------------
Every history has bright and shadow.
BTW, do you know something Chinese suicide walkers?
If you know it, could you show me some information or useful link?
I have ever heard that Chinese suicide walkers were disclosed when glasnost (perestroika) in China,
In Korean War, Chinese suicide walkers, alleged Chinese political offenders, as advance guards, rushed into vast extent of minefields in North Korea and blasted all of them out in an instance by human-wave tactics, while the walkers would be shut if they go back. Thereafter, the main body of Chinese troops went forward to South.
------------------------------------------------------
For the mutual happiness, understanding each other with mutual respect is fundamental.
No punishment without law, No guilty without evidence.
Japan focuses on the fact, not denying but accepting as same as shí shì qiú shì in Chinese.
All you need is just show Japan CLEAR evidences such as primary sources as soon as possible unless no evidence from the beginning. Even if a large number of forged photos and evidences of UFO, you can still say you believe UFO, and may hardly deny the existence of U.F.O.
However, we should not discuss fantasy any more.
Alleged Nanjing Massacre and FAKE OF NANJING have resulted in VERY BASIC 10 questions.
Imperial Japan had occupied Nanjing on Dec.13, 1937.
[Q1]Why did the population increase within a month between the incident from 200,000 (Nov.28 1937, Dec.18 1937, Dec.21 1937) to 250,000 (Jan.14 1938)?
[Q2]Where were the killed 300,000 innocent Chinese dead bodies?
[Q3]Why did many Chinese citizens come back to Nanjing after Imperial Japan occupied the city?
[Q4] Were the 572 crime cases really committed by Japanese?
Security Committee reported 572 crime cases(murder 94, rape 243, plunder 201, arson 34) of Japanese soldiers, but only one Chinese crime case(sneak thief) for a month from Nanjing-fall to the time when Nanjing Police Agency was organized. But, for a month from then Police Agency arrested about 500 Chinese crime cases.
[Q5] Why did KMT NOT condemn Japanese army about it at all?
KMT held about 300 press conferences in Hangkow for a year from Nanjing fall. But why didn't correspondents ask any questions about the massacre at all?
[Q6]Why did China paid money to Harold John Timperley, an Australian, for writing the Japan’s atrocity story to a book, according to Tseng Hsu-pai’s autobiography?
[Q7]Why could China NOT prove the murder of 340,000 when the Tokyo Trial was opened?
[Q8]Why did Mao NOT mention any of them at the international media conferences from 1937 to 1938?
[Q9]Why did CCP NOT write anything about the massacre on textbooks till 1981 at all?
[Q10]Why did China fabricate 143 pictures in the Nanjing Museum?
(FYI)
During Nanjing battle "Three alls policy" or "Burned all, killed all, and looted all" were implemented by Chinese military rather than by Japanese military, as New York Times reported. On the other hand, about 40,000 prisoners of war rather than citizens were killed by Japanese military.
(1937-12-08 New York Times by Tillman Durdin) http://www.ne.jp/asahi/unko/tamezou/nankin/1937-12-08-NewYorkTimesTillmanDurdin.html
(1937-12-09 New York Times by Hallett Abend) http://www.ne.jp/asahi/unko/tamezou/nankin/1937-12-09-NewYorkTimesHallettAbend.html
-------------------------------------------------
@Gioklie Tanthe
Again,
All you need is just show Japan CLEAR evidences such as primary sources as soon as possible unless no evidence from the beginning. Even if a large number of forged photos and evidences of UFO, you can still say you believe UFO, and may hardly deny the existence of U.F.O.
However, we should not discuss fantasy any more.
-------------------------------------------------------
(Note)
Mr. Nevin Taylor was my unforgettable best ally.
If Japanese public figures such as Shintaro Ishihara, continue to deny that the Rape of Nanjing ever happened, the pain will remain―a useful tool for propagandists.
March 7, 2014 4:03 p.m. ET
"China's World: Keeping History's Horrors Alive" (World News, Feb. 26) makes a good point about China keeping the wounds of World War II open. I think that those wounds would close a lot cleaner and the scar would be less sore if the Japanese would acknowledge that the wounds exist.
As long as Japanese public figures such as Shintaro Ishihara, former governor of Tokyo, continue to deny that atrocities like the Rape of Nanjing ever happened, the pain will remain―a useful tool for propagandists.
John W. Caldwell
Dadeville Ala.
It is a lamentable mystery why the Japanese are excused from their sordid history of massacre. The answer may be that the Filipinos, Indonesians, Singaporeans, Burmese and countless others need to emulate the proper and effective techniques utilized by world Jewry in keeping the memory of death by massacre and genocide alive.
Myron Gananian
Menlo Park, Calif.
Japanese history textbooks barely mention Nanjing. Their actions say so much more than words. Given that, it doesn't seem out of left field that China and other Asian countries view Prime Minister Shinzo Abe's visit to the Yasukuni war shrine, in addition to his other comments, as some sort of threat.
Sonia Wong-Gerig
Oakdale, N.Y.
-----------------------------------------
@Justin Zhou
O.K. Let’s go forward.
I sincerely let you know another fact, footprint between the U.S. and Japan.
Peliryu island in Palau had one of the fiercest battles between the U.S. and Imperial Japan from Sep. 15 to Nov. 25, 1944.
On Sep. 15 1999, Japanese commemoration ceremony was held at Peliryu shrine in the island. The U.S. Marine veterans attended the Japanese ceremony.
Peliryu shrine has a monument with an inscription which U.S. Pacific Fleet admiral C.W. Nimitz was believed to compose, “Tourists from every country who visit this island should be told how courageous and patriotic were the Japanese soldiers who all died defending this island.”
On the same day, the U.S. commemoration ceremony was held at Bloody Nose Ridge in the island. At the U.S. ceremony, granddaughter of general Hideki Tojo offered a floral tribute, and son of admiral Tamon Yamaguchi raised his hand in salute to Bloody Nose Ridge Monument.
Bless you.
----------------------------------------------
@GARY FIELD
German compensation:
Most Japanese recognizes that Germany has compensated for Jewish genocide victims, but not yet for WW2 victim nation, people and companies. Therefore, whenever western, Chinese or Koran says “Japan should learn German way for compensation”, Japanese feel strange because Japan has fulfilled legal responsibilities and finished compensation completely and finally. In my understanding, in 1944 Germany captured 5.16 million Russian POWs, 470,000 were executed, 3 millions in POW camp were died from hunger. In 1996 negotiation between Germany and Poland began, $400 per each were tentatively paid for one million living forced workers. In 1953 Germany had concluded treaty for $20 billion compensation with the United Ally, but has not paid yet.
As you mentioned “German children learn Holocaust”. How about WW2?
Therefore, you may not know if Germany has compensated for ww2 victim nation, people and companies. Therefore, you should not say “Japan should learn German way” any more, right?
NANKING DEATH TOLL
All the primary sources support Japanese appeal number of around 40,000, however, never prove Chinese appeal number of 300,000.
That means, Japan has never denied the fact but accepted it while China has denied the fact and insisted revision. As a result, second source and thereafter source have been needed.
Above recognition must be bottom line for further exploring the issue beyond prejudges.
As you protest against Dr. Smythe’s research, you can show credible source of 200,000 as “revision”. We can discuss “revision” not only about death toll but also about ethnic unique way of slaughter.
Primary source
It is essential for due process not only academic and legal area but also real world including cyberspace. Even in Japanese domestic BBS, everybody requires source and identifies if it is primary, secondary or thereafter in order to avoid perjury and false charge.
Knights of Bushido
It can be reference but not primary source for discussion.
If you say some opinions with reasoning only by the book, your opinion may be objectively not enough strong. You can use the book as reference for logical thinking and background information.
Well, O.K. anyways, I will read the book in the future, maybe after several months…..or….within a year….maybe….
I provide you real primary source, the U.S. national archives.
100,000 Pages Declassified in Search for Japanese War Crimes Records
http://www.archives.gov/press/press-releases/2007/nr07-47.html
------------------------------------------------------------------------
@GARY FIELD
You mentioned lots of topics. Let's step by step. I like to converge topics into Nanjing incident to explore more.
(1)Tomio Hora is a famous pro-China person. His position is "First South attacked, second North counterattacked in Korean war " . Also, I have pointed out "Three ALLs policy was Chinese policy rather than Japanese". We can discuss later.
(2)If German compensated, National archives exist. Could you show me VERY primary source? The wiki mentioned quite different from Japanese recognition. This is absolutely information gap between Japan and Nations resulting communication gap such as between you and I.
(3)Primary source is essential for due process and All the primary source mentioned much below the number in Nanjing.
(4)[Next question to explore how Japan killed citizens in Nanjing]
Why did many Chinese citizens come back to Nanjing even after Imperial Japan, alleged "Massacres","Slaughters" and “Riben Guizi Monsters”, occupied the city?
Primary sources show coherent and non-contradict.
Dec 13 1937 200,000-250,000 (Dr. Smythe)(James Espy of the American vice-consul)
Jan 1938 250,000 (THE NORTH-CHINA DAILY NEWS)
Feb 1938 250,000 (Telegraph toward the Washington Secretary of State in the U.S.)
Feb 1938 250,000 (Dr. Bates)
Mar 1938 250,000 (Dr. Smythe)
Apr 1938 250,000-270,000 (Dr. Smythe)
(FYI)
Cited:
"WAR DAMAGE IN THE NANKING AREA" December, 1937 to March, 1938
URBAN AND RURAL SURVEYS By Dr. Lewis S. C. Smythe
http://www.history.gr.jp/~nanking/LSCSmythe.pdf
CITY SURVEY, POPULATION
The city of Nanking had before the war a population of just 1,000,000, which was considerably reduced by repeated bombings and latterly by approaching attack and the removal of all Chinese governmental organs. At the time the city fell (December 12-13), its population was between 200,000 and 250,000.
The persons reported in our sampling survey in March, multiplied by 50, give 221,150 as the population directly represented by the City Survey. This number was probably 80 to 90 per cent of the total residents at that time, some of whom lived in places not accessible to investigators.
There was no great change in February and March, but a noticeable inflow from less orderly areas near the city probably built up a small surplus over departures, which also were visible significant.
-------------------------------------------------
@Susan Lim
Let's focus on the fact, not denying but accepting, O.K?
We will find who is denying the fact. You said "Japanese deny history". Are you sure? Japan has accepted the fact, not denying.
Though you mentioned lots of topics, we are discussing Nanjing incident now.
So by step by step, shall we start discussion about Nanjing incident first?
I show you primary source below. Do you deny the fact or accept it?
"WAR DAMAGE IN THE NANKING AREA" December, 1937 to March, 1938
URBAN AND RURAL SURVEYS By Dr. Lewis S. C. Smythe
http://www.history.gr.jp/~nanking/LSCSmythe.pdf
In return, could you show me "the fact" you think?
All you need is to show Japan CLEAR evidences such as primary sources as soon as possible unless no evidence from the beginning.
Otherwise, you fail interpretation or perjury.
(FYI)
Primary sources are original materials that have not been altered or distorted in any way. Example of non-primary source is such as wiki and information from the person who knows the sister of the friend of her aunt of the witness.
I am here.
-------------------------------------------
@GARY FIELD
The U.S. and Japan drills together today as usual.
Ignoring the today's fact and footsteps between the U.S. and Japan,
Jusutin simply tried to promote hate emotion by the movie of the past war.
---------------------------------------------
Just a TPO stuff.
When purely academic study and discussion purpose, such would be acceptable for everybody.
Let's keep holding honorable mutual respect mentality and sincere attitude especially when we discuss touchy issues.
I know this topic requires us mental toughness.
Let's go forward.
--------------------------------------------
@ Justin Zhou
Let’s shí shì qiú shì (Based on the facts, searching for the truth of the case) (objective positivism).
We should not discuss fantasy any more.
Again and again,
all you need is to show Japan CLEAR evidences such as primary sources as soon as possible unless no evidence from the beginning.
-------------------------------------------------
Every history has bright and shadow.
BTW, do you know something Chinese suicide walkers?
If you know it, could you show me some information or useful link?
I have ever heard that Chinese suicide walkers were disclosed when glasnost (perestroika) in China,
In Korean War, Chinese suicide walkers, alleged Chinese political offenders, as advance guards, rushed into vast extent of minefields in North Korea and blasted all of them out in an instance by human-wave tactics, while the walkers would be shut if they go back. Thereafter, the main body of Chinese troops went forward to South.
------------------------------------------------------
For the mutual happiness, understanding each other with mutual respect is fundamental.
No punishment without law, No guilty without evidence.
Japan focuses on the fact, not denying but accepting as same as shí shì qiú shì in Chinese.
All you need is just show Japan CLEAR evidences such as primary sources as soon as possible unless no evidence from the beginning. Even if a large number of forged photos and evidences of UFO, you can still say you believe UFO, and may hardly deny the existence of U.F.O.
However, we should not discuss fantasy any more.
Alleged Nanjing Massacre and FAKE OF NANJING have resulted in VERY BASIC 10 questions.
Imperial Japan had occupied Nanjing on Dec.13, 1937.
[Q1]Why did the population increase within a month between the incident from 200,000 (Nov.28 1937, Dec.18 1937, Dec.21 1937) to 250,000 (Jan.14 1938)?
[Q2]Where were the killed 300,000 innocent Chinese dead bodies?
[Q3]Why did many Chinese citizens come back to Nanjing after Imperial Japan occupied the city?
[Q4] Were the 572 crime cases really committed by Japanese?
Security Committee reported 572 crime cases(murder 94, rape 243, plunder 201, arson 34) of Japanese soldiers, but only one Chinese crime case(sneak thief) for a month from Nanjing-fall to the time when Nanjing Police Agency was organized. But, for a month from then Police Agency arrested about 500 Chinese crime cases.
[Q5] Why did KMT NOT condemn Japanese army about it at all?
KMT held about 300 press conferences in Hangkow for a year from Nanjing fall. But why didn't correspondents ask any questions about the massacre at all?
[Q6]Why did China paid money to Harold John Timperley, an Australian, for writing the Japan’s atrocity story to a book, according to Tseng Hsu-pai’s autobiography?
[Q7]Why could China NOT prove the murder of 340,000 when the Tokyo Trial was opened?
[Q8]Why did Mao NOT mention any of them at the international media conferences from 1937 to 1938?
[Q9]Why did CCP NOT write anything about the massacre on textbooks till 1981 at all?
[Q10]Why did China fabricate 143 pictures in the Nanjing Museum?
(FYI)
During Nanjing battle "Three alls policy" or "Burned all, killed all, and looted all" were implemented by Chinese military rather than by Japanese military, as New York Times reported. On the other hand, about 40,000 prisoners of war rather than citizens were killed by Japanese military.
(1937-12-08 New York Times by Tillman Durdin) http://www.ne.jp/asahi/unko/tamezou/nankin/1937-12-08-NewYorkTimesTillmanDurdin.html
(1937-12-09 New York Times by Hallett Abend) http://www.ne.jp/asahi/unko/tamezou/nankin/1937-12-09-NewYorkTimesHallettAbend.html
-------------------------------------------------
@Gioklie Tanthe
Again,
All you need is just show Japan CLEAR evidences such as primary sources as soon as possible unless no evidence from the beginning. Even if a large number of forged photos and evidences of UFO, you can still say you believe UFO, and may hardly deny the existence of U.F.O.
However, we should not discuss fantasy any more.
-------------------------------------------------------
(Note)
Mr. Nevin Taylor was my unforgettable best ally.